Latest Mitchell column: Possible XFL & NFL relationship?

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Re: Latest Mitchell column: Possible XFL & NFL relationship?

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4th&long wrote: Thu Nov 18, 2021 11:04 pm
GregParks wrote: Thu Nov 18, 2021 10:18 pm
Tank55 wrote: Thu Nov 18, 2021 8:52 pm

I think XFL 2.0 was pitch perfect here -- you can acknowledge the NFL and even your players' ambitions while still treating your own league with self-respect.
Fair enough. But again, feels like there are a lot of different directions this could conceivably go to satisfy all parties.

I guess the key take from Mike's column is the "business relationship" part, which sounds a lot less ominous than any kind of NFL takeover of the league or making it a full developmental brand. And could also make most of this conversation moot.
I could see NFL using a relationship with XFL to blunt USFL and then dropping that relationship. XFL beware.
Why would the NFL do that to the USFL?
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Re: Latest Mitchell column: Possible XFL & NFL relationship?

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GregParks wrote: Fri Nov 19, 2021 11:34 am
4th&long wrote: Thu Nov 18, 2021 11:04 pm
GregParks wrote: Thu Nov 18, 2021 10:18 pm

Fair enough. But again, feels like there are a lot of different directions this could conceivably go to satisfy all parties.

I guess the key take from Mike's column is the "business relationship" part, which sounds a lot less ominous than any kind of NFL takeover of the league or making it a full developmental brand. And could also make most of this conversation moot.
I could see NFL using a relationship with XFL to blunt USFL and then dropping that relationship. XFL beware.
Why would the NFL do that to the USFL?
My guess is they’re assuming the USFL follows what Flutie said and wants to compete in 5 or 6 years. I still don’t think the nfl really cares what happens in the spring and also don’t want a working agreement with a league
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Re: Latest Mitchell column: Possible XFL & NFL relationship?

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4th&long wrote: Thu Nov 18, 2021 11:04 pmIts what AAF wanted.
Yeah, exactly. That came through in their product presentation.
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Re: Latest Mitchell column: Possible XFL & NFL relationship?

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laxtreme56 wrote: Fri Nov 19, 2021 10:43 am I don't think it's a bad idea to have the NFL involved. The NFL is the king of all sports leagues and makes insane amounts of money every year. If they were to pay the XFL, say $20 million a year to test out rules, develop referees and lower level practice squad players, and have a game of the week on NFL network, it's a win-win for everyone. I know people scoff at the minor league label, but at the end of the day, that's exactly what spring football is. There may be a reason Redbird hired all these NFL and network execs., the NFL has much more to gain by partnering with the XFL than with the CFL and their vastly different rule set.
Here's the problem, though:
1. The NFL has already decided they don't need to spend that $20 million a year. The teams are businesses. Any investment is going to have to bring a return on that investment. What is the return for investing in a "developmental league?" Maybe a few more players into the pool? How does that sell tickets? How does that improve TV revenue? It doesn't.
2. The player's union doesn't want practice squad players at risk of injury, and what fans would want to watch players who have already proven they can't make an NFL roster? Part of the appeal of the XFL 2.0 was that its players could conceivably make an NFL roster, even if they were backups, but chose not to.

Despite what you may hear, there is absolutely zero demand—from the NFL, from players, from fans—for a player development league.
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Re: Latest Mitchell column: Possible XFL & NFL relationship?

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4th&long wrote: Thu Nov 18, 2021 11:04 pm I could see NFL using a relationship with XFL to blunt USFL and then dropping that relationship. XFL beware.
That assumes that the USFL at this point is anything more than a gadfly... and I'm not convinced that it is.
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Re: Latest Mitchell column: Possible XFL & NFL relationship?

Post by 4th&long »

johnnyangryfuzzball wrote: Fri Nov 19, 2021 5:38 pm
4th&long wrote: Thu Nov 18, 2021 11:04 pm I could see NFL using a relationship with XFL to blunt USFL and then dropping that relationship. XFL beware.
That assumes that the USFL at this point is anything more than a gadfly... and I'm not convinced that it is.
my point is they'd rather some entity they influence then one they don't

gadfly or not they don't like any alt
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Re: Latest Mitchell column: Possible XFL & NFL relationship?

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The NFL is aware that they are considered old and stodgy ie No Fun League, and I think the eagerness that some alt. football leagues have explored re-imagining the game and rules, have them a bit edgy. A lot of the new rules in XFL 2.0 were really liked and appreciated by the fans and I am sure there would have been more tweaks sans Covid. If that is correct, perhaps it is then a stifling-type control issue more than anything else.
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Re: Latest Mitchell column: Possible XFL & NFL relationship?

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4th&long wrote: Sun Nov 21, 2021 10:11 pm
gadfly or not they don't like any alt
But why not? It's win-win for the NFL: Potential future NFL contributors get a place to develop where the NFL can sign them basically at any time (depending on league contracts, but no serious prospective NFL player is going to sign one that locks them out of reaching the NFL), and it's at no cost to the NFL or its owners. Consider it one big practice squad that they don't have to pay for. I even recall Luck or someone else in XFL management saying the NFL supports what they're doing, and why wouldn't they? It's not like the XFL or any league is going to be a threat to ANYTHING the NFL is doing.

The idea that the NFL would be worried about any alternative league, much less to the point they would actively try to hold one back, is laughable. As for the Flutie quote mentioned earlier in the thread about the USFL competing with the NFL down the line, w/o knowing the full context of the quote, that tells me I don't need to take him seriously as a league mouthpiece. It's also a red flag for me about the USFL's business plan moving forward if that's how the league is viewing things. You're not going to win in a competition of any kind with the NFL.
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Re: Latest Mitchell column: Possible XFL & NFL relationship?

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GregParks wrote: Tue Nov 23, 2021 11:07 am
4th&long wrote: Sun Nov 21, 2021 10:11 pm
gadfly or not they don't like any alt
But why not? It's win-win for the NFL: Potential future NFL contributors get a place to develop where the NFL can sign them basically at any time (depending on league contracts, but no serious prospective NFL player is going to sign one that locks them out of reaching the NFL), and it's at no cost to the NFL or its owners. Consider it one big practice squad that they don't have to pay for. I even recall Luck or someone else in XFL management saying the NFL supports what they're doing, and why wouldn't they? It's not like the XFL or any league is going to be a threat to ANYTHING the NFL is doing.

The idea that the NFL would be worried about any alternative league, much less to the point they would actively try to hold one back, is laughable. As for the Flutie quote mentioned earlier in the thread about the USFL competing with the NFL down the line, w/o knowing the full context of the quote, that tells me I don't need to take him seriously as a league mouthpiece. It's also a red flag for me about the USFL's business plan moving forward if that's how the league is viewing things. You're not going to win in a competition of any kind with the NFL.
I'm basing it on NFL's past experience with alt leagues. Regardless of our perceptions one thing they did NOT want the WLAF to become was the "NFL of the summer" which Tex Scrhamm slipped he was striving to become. Also NFL E was in Europe as it was not a threat along with building a new base X-USA. The NFL does not want to fund a league or even televise for free (AAF paid to be on NFLN). as other have mentioned the NFLPA would need to sign off on assigning players and that is unlikely, with Demaurice the tool as NFLPA admin. Now can that change? Perhaps but NFL does not want to subsidize a league they don't make $$$ on, nor do they want to make a league $$$ by endorsing with nothing in return sans a few players.
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Re: Latest Mitchell column: Possible XFL & NFL relationship?

Post by GregParks »

4th&long wrote: Tue Nov 23, 2021 11:15 am
GregParks wrote: Tue Nov 23, 2021 11:07 am
4th&long wrote: Sun Nov 21, 2021 10:11 pm
gadfly or not they don't like any alt
But why not? It's win-win for the NFL: Potential future NFL contributors get a place to develop where the NFL can sign them basically at any time (depending on league contracts, but no serious prospective NFL player is going to sign one that locks them out of reaching the NFL), and it's at no cost to the NFL or its owners. Consider it one big practice squad that they don't have to pay for. I even recall Luck or someone else in XFL management saying the NFL supports what they're doing, and why wouldn't they? It's not like the XFL or any league is going to be a threat to ANYTHING the NFL is doing.

The idea that the NFL would be worried about any alternative league, much less to the point they would actively try to hold one back, is laughable. As for the Flutie quote mentioned earlier in the thread about the USFL competing with the NFL down the line, w/o knowing the full context of the quote, that tells me I don't need to take him seriously as a league mouthpiece. It's also a red flag for me about the USFL's business plan moving forward if that's how the league is viewing things. You're not going to win in a competition of any kind with the NFL.
I'm basing it on NFL's past experience with alt leagues. Regardless of our perceptions one thing they did NOT want the WLAF to become was the "NFL of the summer" which Tex Scrhamm slipped he was striving to become. Also NFL E was in Europe as it was not a threat along with building a new base X-USA. The NFL does not want to fund a league or even televise for free (AAF paid to be on NFLN). as other have mentioned the NFLPA would need to sign off on assigning players and that is unlikely, with Demaurice the tool as NFLPA admin. Now can that change? Perhaps but NFL does not want to subsidize a league they don't make $$$ on, nor do they want to make a league $$$ by endorsing with nothing in return sans a few players.
Those previous alt leagues you're talking about were MANY years ago, when the NFL while popular was not the behemoth it is today. It's a bit like comparing apples to oranges. It would be more relevant to compare it to the most recent XFL, AAF, AFL, UFL, etc., which, to my knowledge, the NFL did nothing with which to interfere.

And I don't think anyone is saying the NFL is going to fund a league or even assign players to one. I think most people, realistically speaking, are thinking a lot smaller when it comes to any kind of "deal" they make with the XFL. You are right to raise the question though: How far will the NFL go to "help" an alternative league make money, and what is their expected ROI? I think that's what makes any kind of partnership difficult to predict.
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