XFL officially delays start until 2023

XFL Football discussion.
4th&long
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Re: XFL officially delays start until 2023

Post by 4th&long »

MGB01 wrote: Thu Jul 15, 2021 7:09 pm While the XFL deserves plenty of 😡😡😡😡😡 for some serious naivete don't just jump on them. The USFL's got about six weeks (being generous) to announce something big, there's been nothing since the announcement and the only mention of any relative investment was in the SA News Express this week about Jim Bob Morris, that's it.

It's fine to be all WTF over Garcia's initial "oh they'll just come to us" strategy but when Woods/FOX's is in danger of not being much better, a little more evenly spread here?
The USFL announced a season in 2022 with FOX as a founder and TV partner, after a successful 2021 TSL spring season and Covid cropped fall 2020 season. The XFL 3.0 has passed on 2021 season (Oct 2020), then passed on 2022 season (Jul 2021), and is now saying 2023 a full 3 years after a 5 week season in 2020.

Those are the facts. This isn't a USFL vs XFL thing. The USFL was announced on June 3 by FOX and will be televised on FOX. The announcement alone is a big deal. The USFL was announce just 6 weeks ago. I hope the XFL gets moving but so far they have not and keep pushing out their lauch date.
MGB01
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Re: XFL officially delays start until 2023

Post by MGB01 »

I know all that, but what's next? When XFL1.0 announced a deal with NBC over Wrestlemania weekend in 2000, there were little bits of news leading up the team reveals in August. When XFL2.0 announced with ESPN and FOX two years ago, same deal. Now the USFL's website is effectively a placeholder (as well as their Twitter and FB) that might as well be MLFB's useless 50% financial info much less anything else --doesn't even have to be news, just little 'we're here and we can't wait ' updates

Maybe the XFL's playing, what they consider, smart money over here, thinking "We'll let them go Kitty Hawk, and (re)build ourselves in quiet". Why is it smart? A TSL rebrand simply won't work, and the name value (both teams and league) only has so much shelf life before it's time to move with it.

I don't want the USFL to fail, far from it, in fact I'm even setting my 2022 XFL sim season to it. But seeing the same "They'll come anyway" naive logic used by Garcia (only difference is Woods is further along--only here it doesn't make much of a difference) isn't giving himself the greatest chance of success right off the bat. 400K is fine for a placeholder, not the place.
4th&long
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Re: XFL officially delays start until 2023

Post by 4th&long »

MGB01 wrote: Thu Jul 15, 2021 11:23 pm I know all that, but what's next? When XFL1.0 announced a deal with NBC over Wrestlemania weekend in 2000, there were little bits of news leading up the team reveals in August. When XFL2.0 announced with ESPN and FOX two years ago, same deal. Now the USFL's website is effectively a placeholder (as well as their Twitter and FB) that might as well be MLFB's useless 50% financial info much less anything else --doesn't even have to be news, just little 'we're here and we can't wait ' updates

Maybe the XFL's playing, what they consider, smart money over here, thinking "We'll let them go Kitty Hawk, and (re)build ourselves in quiet". Why is it smart? A TSL rebrand simply won't work, and the name value (both teams and league) only has so much shelf life before it's time to move with it.

I don't want the USFL to fail, far from it, in fact I'm even setting my 2022 XFL sim season to it. But seeing the same "They'll come anyway" naive logic used by Garcia (only difference is Woods is further along--only here it doesn't make much of a difference) isn't giving himself the greatest chance of success right off the bat. 400K is fine for a placeholder, not the place.
USFL is not MLFB. At any rate - we see it differently and I'm not quite sure what your opinion on the 2 leagues is but I'll leave it at that.
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Re: XFL officially delays start until 2023

Post by MGB01 »

I didn't try to equate otherwise other than the fact that their websites have the same amount of useful info at the moment
laxtreme56
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Re: XFL officially delays start until 2023

Post by laxtreme56 »

MGB01 wrote: Thu Jul 15, 2021 11:23 pm I know all that, but what's next? When XFL1.0 announced a deal with NBC over Wrestlemania weekend in 2000, there were little bits of news leading up the team reveals in August. When XFL2.0 announced with ESPN and FOX two years ago, same deal. Now the USFL's website is effectively a placeholder (as well as their Twitter and FB) that might as well be MLFB's useless 50% financial info much less anything else --doesn't even have to be news, just little 'we're here and we can't wait ' updates

Maybe the XFL's playing, what they consider, smart money over here, thinking "We'll let them go Kitty Hawk, and (re)build ourselves in quiet". Why is it smart? A TSL rebrand simply won't work, and the name value (both teams and league) only has so much shelf life before it's time to move with it.

I don't want the USFL to fail, far from it, in fact I'm even setting my 2022 XFL sim season to it. But seeing the same "They'll come anyway" naive logic used by Garcia (only difference is Woods is further along--only here it doesn't make much of a difference) isn't giving himself the greatest chance of success right off the bat. 400K is fine for a placeholder, not the place.
This is a very fair assessment. We've heard the USFL is looking for individual ownership groups, which makes sense as B. Woods doesn't have nearly the funds to run a paying 8 team professional league. So between now and March we're supposed to see 8-10 teams, front office hires, some kind of national and regional marketing plan, venue leases and agreements. 400k viewers isn't going to pay the bills with 8-10 teams of 50+ players per teams. Can any of these potential markets sell 5k+ season tickets and $1 million+ in local sponsorship before the intended kickoff, my magic 8 ball says "no way." Besides Fox saying their "invested" what does that really mean. If it's anything like we've seen with similar leagues, they'll cover the costs of production and share in the profits (if any) while providing some minor marketing of the league in non primetime spots. If it's a TSL rebrand, I won't bother watching. If I wanted to watch guys pay to play there's plenty of flag football leagues I could go watch on a Sunday afternoon.
4th&long
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Re: XFL officially delays start until 2023

Post by 4th&long »

laxtreme56 wrote: Fri Jul 16, 2021 6:52 am
MGB01 wrote: Thu Jul 15, 2021 11:23 pm I know all that, but what's next? When XFL1.0 announced a deal with NBC over Wrestlemania weekend in 2000, there were little bits of news leading up the team reveals in August. When XFL2.0 announced with ESPN and FOX two years ago, same deal. Now the USFL's website is effectively a placeholder (as well as their Twitter and FB) that might as well be MLFB's useless 50% financial info much less anything else --doesn't even have to be news, just little 'we're here and we can't wait ' updates

Maybe the XFL's playing, what they consider, smart money over here, thinking "We'll let them go Kitty Hawk, and (re)build ourselves in quiet". Why is it smart? A TSL rebrand simply won't work, and the name value (both teams and league) only has so much shelf life before it's time to move with it.

I don't want the USFL to fail, far from it, in fact I'm even setting my 2022 XFL sim season to it. But seeing the same "They'll come anyway" naive logic used by Garcia (only difference is Woods is further along--only here it doesn't make much of a difference) isn't giving himself the greatest chance of success right off the bat. 400K is fine for a placeholder, not the place.
This is a very fair assessment. We've heard the USFL is looking for individual ownership groups, which makes sense as B. Woods doesn't have nearly the funds to run a paying 8 team professional league. So between now and March we're supposed to see 8-10 teams, front office hires, some kind of national and regional marketing plan, venue leases and agreements. 400k viewers isn't going to pay the bills with 8-10 teams of 50+ players per teams. Can any of these potential markets sell 5k+ season tickets and $1 million+ in local sponsorship before the intended kickoff, my magic 8 ball says "no way." Besides Fox saying their "invested" what does that really mean. If it's anything like we've seen with similar leagues, they'll cover the costs of production and share in the profits (if any) while providing some minor marketing of the league in non primetime spots. If it's a TSL rebrand, I won't bother watching. If I wanted to watch guys pay to play there's plenty of flag football leagues I could go watch on a Sunday afternoon.
Like I laid out in a post above - I don't see the USFL being run like AAF/XFL and respective cost structure. I'm thinking 30-40% the cost or less if its more a rebrand and only partially based in cities. And to clarify the vast majority of the TSL players DO NOT pay to play - they dont get paid other than R&B but if they've been to a recent NFL camp, or roster, PS there's no charge along with TSL alum.
We don't know FOX's involvement $$ wise but I also posted where they were providing TSL funds (per B Woods) as he said he needed self discipline to not over spend the money. Recall FOX approached B Woods not the other way around. FOX NEEDS low cost programming.
As far as the TSL's 400k+ viewers. That was with an unrecognized league, virtually no promotion or advertising, with no city affiliation. Sometimes will no lead in program at all. And still they got 400k+.

Next up is the USFL - if it fails we'll know soon, XFL has 3x delayed (well 2x with D/R/Rk). I could care less which one makes it as we all know how hard it is to do so. Just Win Baby! - AL Davis
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Firecop
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Re: XFL officially delays start until 2023

Post by Firecop »

Have to disagree here MGB, many things were both promised, intimated, and implied by the new XFL ownership group; not so much with the USFL owners. I am not specifically referring to the lack of on field play and yearly start date pushbacks, but more in the communications and engagement areas. The XFL group's lack of communication has resulted in much dismay and disgruntlement among its most ardent fans. This was s serious faux pas IMO. The USFL will be interesting to follow and I wish them success in whatever model they end up pursuing; the more "real" football, the better! To say that the air has gone out of the new XFL ownership's balloon would be a gross understatement. As a previous XFL season ticket holder for example, I have never been contacted by the new ownership group - that's insane! Even if they have nothing new to report, they could tell us that there is nothing currently to report. It would not hurt them to throw out occasional tidbits of information, even if it is rather miniscule. In short, they have really shot themselves in the foot and the only thing that will save them is to eventually put a really terrific product on the field - someday...
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4th&long
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Re: XFL officially delays start until 2023

Post by 4th&long »

Firecop wrote: Fri Jul 16, 2021 10:32 am Have to disagree here MGB, many things were both promised, intimated, and implied by the new XFL ownership group; not so much with the USFL owners. I am not specifically referring to the lack of on field play and yearly start date pushbacks, but more in the communications and engagement areas. The XFL group's lack of communication has resulted in much dismay and disgruntlement among its most ardent fans. This was s serious faux pas IMO. The USFL will be interesting to follow and I wish them success in whatever model they end up pursuing; the more "real" football, the better! To say that the air has gone out of the new XFL ownership's balloon would be a gross understatement. As a previous XFL season ticket holder for example, I have never been contacted by the new ownership group - that's insane! Even if they have nothing new to report, they could tell us that there is nothing currently to report. It would not hurt them to throw out occasional tidbits of information, even if it is rather miniscule. In short, they have really shot themselves in the foot and the only thing that will save them is to eventually put a really terrific product on the field - someday...
Wow - that implies they never had any intention of launching in 2022 (let alone 2021). I keep going back to this report and is the likely reason why.

>>The consensus from sources I was in contact with was that RedBird Capital would not put one more dollar into the XFL until they secured a lucrative media rights deal.

While the majority of the focus on the current XFL is on the historic nature of Dany Garcia and ‘The Rock’s” ownership/leadership of the league.

The truth is that RedBird Capital is a big factor in the movement and execution of the XFL, and ultimately, a deciding factor in how the league does business. <<

No Media company will do that until the league is up and running - so its a unlikely to happen. Unless the XFL 3.0 ownership team changes that mind set - and opens their wallet and spend first, no media rights deal is likely. The XFL wanted to leverage the CFL for that and the CFL didn't see enough benefit v risk. So its no surprise that they haven't contacted you at this point. shame, you Seattle fans were strong, and growing.
MGB01
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Re: XFL officially delays start until 2023

Post by MGB01 »

Firecop wrote: Fri Jul 16, 2021 10:32 am Have to disagree here MGB, many things were both promised, intimated, and implied by the new XFL ownership group; not so much with the USFL owners. I am not specifically referring to the lack of on field play and yearly start date pushbacks, but more in the communications and engagement areas. The XFL group's lack of communication has resulted in much dismay and disgruntlement among its most ardent fans. This was s serious faux pas IMO. The USFL will be interesting to follow and I wish them success in whatever model they end up pursuing; the more "real" football, the better! To say that the air has gone out of the new XFL ownership's balloon would be a gross understatement. As a previous XFL season ticket holder for example, I have never been contacted by the new ownership group - that's insane! Even if they have nothing new to report, they could tell us that there is nothing currently to report. It would not hurt them to throw out occasional tidbits of information, even if it is rather miniscule. In short, they have really shot themselves in the foot and the only thing that will save them is to eventually put a really terrific product on the field - someday...
I was talking about XFL 1/2, not 3 (definite flag on the field there). In fact with no TV announcement I couldn't possibly have been referring to the latter.
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