XFL - One year after kick off... and waiting

XFL Football discussion.
4th&long
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Re: XFL - One year after kick off... and waiting

Post by 4th&long »

Tank55 wrote: Wed Feb 10, 2021 6:47 pm
4th&long wrote: Wed Feb 10, 2021 4:43 pmMy point is no network is going to be the defacto - investor/risk-taker for a new Alt-FB league.
Again, they're not "investors" or "de facto investors"; they're customers.
You are taking the words too literally - what ever title you ascribe to it - its the money funding the league. And the networks don't want to fund someone else's project (for someone else's benefit), they don't want to commit to that risk upfront.
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Re: XFL - One year after kick off... and waiting

Post by MarkNelson »

Funding IS a big hurdle. You can’t not think of previous leagues, especially the AAF and see how lack of funding did it in.

This XFL has owners with money, and entertainment business savvy. They won’t put their money down unless they see there is a business case for making more money. I will be interested, and pleasantly surprised when I see more evidence and details of that business case, one that I expect to include the 24/7 365 XFL programming that has been hinted. This is a big part of their plan, and might be the piece that sparks droves of new fans to follow XFL 3.0.
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Re: XFL - One year after kick off... and waiting

Post by Rangersking669 »

MarkNelson wrote: Thu Feb 11, 2021 4:59 am Funding IS a big hurdle. You can’t not think of previous leagues, especially the AAF and see how lack of funding did it in.

This XFL has owners with money, and entertainment business savvy. They won’t put their money down unless they see there is a business case for making more money. I will be interested, and pleasantly surprised when I see more evidence and details of that business case, one that I expect to include the 24/7 365 XFL programming that has been hinted. This is a big part of their plan, and might be the piece that sparks droves of new fans to follow XFL 3.0.
I wouldn't be expecting that programming until they actually have staffs hired tbh
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Re: XFL - One year after kick off... and waiting

Post by Firecop »

Semantics aside, any business venture requires a revenue stream, in other words cash flow. Most small businesses don't show any profit in the first two years and larger ones as much as five years. We've all agreed in the past that rear ends in the seats and merchandise sales will not fund as large of an enterprise as an alternative football league. Therefore the question remains how long can or will they sustain losses until they can begin to generate a profit? A broadcast deal, even a short term initial one can stem the cash loss until the on field and management product can prove itself viable - basically Vince's plan. Exposure builds excitement, excitement builds engagement, and engagements builds endurance. The formula for success already exists, if they can just get the right pieces in the right places in the right time period.. Here' hoping!
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Re: XFL - One year after kick off... and waiting

Post by GregParks »

Let's not forget that RedBird Capital are partners in this too, and they manage in the neighborhood of $4 billion dollars in assets. This is not an ownership group that is lacking in money - how much they want to spend is certainly debatable but the idea they don't want to put any of their money into this endeavor seems misleading at best (RedBird's financial role is hinted at with the group's Gerry Cardinale taking a "personal interest" in searching for the league's Chief Football Officer, as the SBJ had it). Perhaps 4th&long can provide a link to the article in which Garcia claimed she didn't want to spend her or the group's money on this project.

As I read the situation, they just may not be willing to take the kind of losses Vince was willing to take for as long as he was willing to take them, hence the search for a paying TV deal from jump. There's a big difference between that, though, and not wanting to spend money at all.
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Re: XFL - One year after kick off... and waiting

Post by Tank55 »

4th&long wrote: Thu Feb 11, 2021 1:22 am You are taking the words too literally - what ever title you ascribe to it - its the money funding the league. And the networks don't want to fund someone else's project (for someone else's benefit), they don't want to commit to that risk upfront.
You're not taking them literally enough. They're not "funding" the league -- stop saying that.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Funding

It's revenue. The network is a customer. They're just also the biggest and most important customer.

If a network knew it could buy the XFL rights for $10M a season and sell $20M in ad space, they'd do it regardless of whether the XFL was going to be viable for the XFL ownership group. The risk to the network isn't that the XFL might fail, the risk is that they only sell $8M in ad space or even $10.5M (in which case they probably could have used the time slot more efficiently).

In 2001, NBC was an owner. So if you're imagining a situation like that, the things you've been saying make a lot more sense.
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Re: XFL - One year after kick off... and waiting

Post by Tank55 »

Look, I think it's totally healthy to be skeptical of the league's chances of success, and I definitely think the onus of proof is on the ownership to demonstrate that they're willing to spend the money necessary to make this thing work. But let's not start twisting who is who in this equation. It's not at all useful to the discussion.
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Re: XFL - One year after kick off... and waiting

Post by 4th&long »

GregParks wrote: Thu Feb 11, 2021 8:53 am Let's not forget that RedBird Capital are partners in this too, and they manage in the neighborhood of $4 billion dollars in assets. This is not an ownership group that is lacking in money - how much they want to spend is certainly debatable but the idea they don't want to put any of their money into this endeavor seems misleading at best (RedBird's financial role is hinted at with the group's Gerry Cardinale taking a "personal interest" in searching for the league's Chief Football Officer, as the SBJ had it). Perhaps 4th&long can provide a link to the article in which Garcia claimed she didn't want to spend her or the group's money on this project.

As I read the situation, they just may not be willing to take the kind of losses Vince was willing to take for as long as he was willing to take them, hence the search for a paying TV deal from jump. There's a big difference between that, though, and not wanting to spend money at all.
GregP,

Here's one place I read it, though it doesn't say "none of their own money" it certainly implies that the lion's share at minimum will need to come from league TV contract (and gate too).

https://xflnewshub.com/columns/xfl-the- ... 22-season/

>> The consensus from sources I was in contact with was that RedBird Capital would not put one more dollar into the XFL until they secured a lucrative media rights deal.
~
The truth is that RedBird Capital is a big factor in the movement and execution of the XFL, and ultimately, a deciding factor in how the league does business.

Here is a telling quote from Dany Garcia in the interview.
~
“Going forward, having media rights deals where there are no fees, that’s not the option that we are looking at, and in fact, we’re in robust conversations with numerous partners.”

Before the XFL made it official that they would be returning in 2022, Dwayne Johnson, one of the league’s co-owners, went on social media and pointed out how they were “looking for the right partners” to fully execute the league’s vision. A hint that XFL 3.0 had not found them yet and that it wouldn’t be an easy process. <<

The timing of their announcement to delay to 2022 and Fox Sports deal with TSL seemed to me that XFL did not get from FS what they needed for 2021 and hence was the real reason to delay until 2022.

Mike M seems to get legit info on the league so I'll go with that and Dany's quotes along the way. Redbird wants outside sources to fund the leagues costs while retaining ownership... at least that's the position through today.

Look I hope they get one (of course!) or close enough to move forward.... however I do think that the XFL's best chance lied with VM and VM repurchasing the league. If this group doesn't make moves by end of March I hope they approach VM about selling to him... IF he is willing to revive in 2022. Or another group that is willing.

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Re: XFL - One year after kick off... and waiting

Post by Rangersking669 »

4th&long wrote: Fri Feb 12, 2021 12:41 am
GregParks wrote: Thu Feb 11, 2021 8:53 am Let's not forget that RedBird Capital are partners in this too, and they manage in the neighborhood of $4 billion dollars in assets. This is not an ownership group that is lacking in money - how much they want to spend is certainly debatable but the idea they don't want to put any of their money into this endeavor seems misleading at best (RedBird's financial role is hinted at with the group's Gerry Cardinale taking a "personal interest" in searching for the league's Chief Football Officer, as the SBJ had it). Perhaps 4th&long can provide a link to the article in which Garcia claimed she didn't want to spend her or the group's money on this project.

As I read the situation, they just may not be willing to take the kind of losses Vince was willing to take for as long as he was willing to take them, hence the search for a paying TV deal from jump. There's a big difference between that, though, and not wanting to spend money at all.
GregP,

Here's one place I read it, though it doesn't say "none of their own money" it certainly implies that the lion's share at minimum will need to come from league TV contract (and gate too).

https://xflnewshub.com/columns/xfl-the- ... 22-season/

>> The consensus from sources I was in contact with was that RedBird Capital would not put one more dollar into the XFL until they secured a lucrative media rights deal.
~
The truth is that RedBird Capital is a big factor in the movement and execution of the XFL, and ultimately, a deciding factor in how the league does business.

Here is a telling quote from Dany Garcia in the interview.
~
“Going forward, having media rights deals where there are no fees, that’s not the option that we are looking at, and in fact, we’re in robust conversations with numerous partners.”

Before the XFL made it official that they would be returning in 2022, Dwayne Johnson, one of the league’s co-owners, went on social media and pointed out how they were “looking for the right partners” to fully execute the league’s vision. A hint that XFL 3.0 had not found them yet and that it wouldn’t be an easy process. <<

The timing of their announcement to delay to 2022 and Fox Sports deal with TSL seemed to me that XFL did not get from FS what they needed for 2021 and hence was the real reason to delay until 2022.

Mike M seems to get legit info on the league so I'll go with that and Dany's quotes along the way. Redbird wants outside sources to fund the leagues costs while retaining ownership... at least that's the position through today.

Look I hope they get one (of course!) or close enough to move forward.... however I do think that the XFL's best chance lied with VM and VM repurchasing the league. If this group doesn't make moves by end of March I hope they approach VM about selling to him... IF he is willing to revive in 2022. Or another group that is willing.

4th
What that article is saying is that RedBird won't fund the league until they accomplish the paid TV deal. NOT that they expect the deal to fund the whole league. Cmon now.
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Re: XFL - One year after kick off... and waiting

Post by 4th&long »

Rangersking669 wrote: Fri Feb 12, 2021 1:27 am
4th&long wrote: Fri Feb 12, 2021 12:41 am
GregParks wrote: Thu Feb 11, 2021 8:53 am Let's not forget that RedBird Capital are partners in this too, and they manage in the neighborhood of $4 billion dollars in assets. This is not an ownership group that is lacking in money - how much they want to spend is certainly debatable but the idea they don't want to put any of their money into this endeavor seems misleading at best (RedBird's financial role is hinted at with the group's Gerry Cardinale taking a "personal interest" in searching for the league's Chief Football Officer, as the SBJ had it). Perhaps 4th&long can provide a link to the article in which Garcia claimed she didn't want to spend her or the group's money on this project.

As I read the situation, they just may not be willing to take the kind of losses Vince was willing to take for as long as he was willing to take them, hence the search for a paying TV deal from jump. There's a big difference between that, though, and not wanting to spend money at all.
GregP,

Here's one place I read it, though it doesn't say "none of their own money" it certainly implies that the lion's share at minimum will need to come from league TV contract (and gate too).

https://xflnewshub.com/columns/xfl-the- ... 22-season/

>> The consensus from sources I was in contact with was that RedBird Capital would not put one more dollar into the XFL until they secured a lucrative media rights deal.
~
The truth is that RedBird Capital is a big factor in the movement and execution of the XFL, and ultimately, a deciding factor in how the league does business.

Here is a telling quote from Dany Garcia in the interview.
~
“Going forward, having media rights deals where there are no fees, that’s not the option that we are looking at, and in fact, we’re in robust conversations with numerous partners.”

Before the XFL made it official that they would be returning in 2022, Dwayne Johnson, one of the league’s co-owners, went on social media and pointed out how they were “looking for the right partners” to fully execute the league’s vision. A hint that XFL 3.0 had not found them yet and that it wouldn’t be an easy process. <<

The timing of their announcement to delay to 2022 and Fox Sports deal with TSL seemed to me that XFL did not get from FS what they needed for 2021 and hence was the real reason to delay until 2022.

Mike M seems to get legit info on the league so I'll go with that and Dany's quotes along the way. Redbird wants outside sources to fund the leagues costs while retaining ownership... at least that's the position through today.

Look I hope they get one (of course!) or close enough to move forward.... however I do think that the XFL's best chance lied with VM and VM repurchasing the league. If this group doesn't make moves by end of March I hope they approach VM about selling to him... IF he is willing to revive in 2022. Or another group that is willing.

4th
What that article is saying is that RedBird won't fund the league until they accomplish the paid TV deal. NOT that they expect the deal to fund the whole league. Cmon now.
Hmmm reread ...

>> The consensus from sources I was in contact with was that RedBird Capital would not put one more dollar into the XFL until they secured a lucrative media rights deal. <<

its got to be LUCRATIVE .... not my words... Mike Mitchell's -
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