OL, Week 6, VM and the XFL bankruptcy

XFL Football discussion.
4th&long
Coach
Posts: 535
Joined: Sun Nov 24, 2019 2:27 pm

OL, Week 6, VM and the XFL bankruptcy

Post by 4th&long » Mon Apr 27, 2020 9:32 pm

Read the full article

https://www.xflnewshub.com/columns/nfl- ... ue-legacy/

>>>> According to sources close to the situation, Vince McMahon did not want to suspend play at that point. McMahon and Luck were at odds over the issue. The delay in making the suspension announcement was Oliver Luck trying to convince McMahon that it was the league’s only recourse.

The XFL had already announced that the week six game between Seattle and LA would be played as scheduled at Century Link Field without fans in attendance. (State orders)

The New York Guardians and Houston Roughnecks were all set to play at Metlife Stadium that weekend despite New Jersey Governor Phil Murphy making a last-second recommendation to limit crowd gatherings.

In an interview with Kevin Gilbride done by Jeff Jacobs from The Middletown Press. Guardians Head Coach Kevin Gilbride broke down his conversation with Vince McMahon; the day league play was suspended
----------
Kevin Gilbride got a call at 4 p.m. on Thursday. The players were finishing their after-practice meetings. Gilbride was told, because of COVID-19, New Jersey Gov. Phil Murphy had issued a statement recommending no crowds of more than 250 should gather.
“The XFL was considering whether we were going to honor it or not,” Gilbride said. “The next thing you know, I got a call at 5 o’clock that Vince McMahon said the hell with it, it was a recommendation. It wasn’t mandatory. We knew we were going to have the biggest crowd of the year. Houston was the top team in the league. He said the hell with it. We’re letting the crowds come.”

At 6 pm., Gilbride got the third call. The XFL had canceled the remainder of their season.

“So in two hours we went from discussing no fans to we’re all done,” Gilbride said. <<<<

I alluded to this in other threads - This was the dagger that killed it for VM - he wanted that week 6 - with no other sports XFL would have dominated. It would have gotten attention it never would have gotten. Now we know the game would have been heavily attended. The league needed a big sendoff if it was going to survive - that would have been it. OL took the safe route, VM needed an Elon Musk, Jeff Bezoa, a real Business man and OL played the part of bureaucrat. (I like OL and he did a great job but don't defy the boss, VM was right.). I hoped VM was all on board but I knew that was a HUGE missed opportunity. VM was NOT on board and eventually he decided he could not work with OL and the XFL is now in bankruptcy and up for sale.

And after major hype we are learning that China Virus may not be that deadly at all under 60 with 40 almost non-existent (certainly under 30 - based on death stats and Antibody tests in NY showing infects 11 times what was reported). NJ had 1100 deaths under 65 thru 4/26. Would this game really matter? Wait for it... we'll be switching to herd immunity by June 1st in all states. [NOTE: Seniors and those with med issues under 60 diff story]

So VM may have realize he over reacted, and he isn't happy with that. No one is. But he is PO'd at OL and that's that.

Metallifreak10
Running Back
Posts: 152
Joined: Tue Oct 29, 2019 9:44 am

Re: OL, Week 6, VM and the XFL bankruptcy

Post by Metallifreak10 » Mon Apr 27, 2020 10:58 pm

I don’t think we’ll be switching to “herd immunity” by June 1st. But, I do think we will switch to something closer to that of Sweden nonetheless.

Vince doesn’t want to cancel for anything. I recall at the time hoping for just one more week of play so the XFL could be the only show in town, just like Vince. Unfortunately, we didn’t have a lot of information about COVID at the time, and it would’ve been hard to justify the risk when every other league canceled play.

Now, we do know some information. Likely death rates being under 1%, and young people being extremely low risk. Not no risk, but low risk. So, with the new information, it’s time we move ahead and continue mitigation, but allow more businesses to open. Hopefully sports will comeback soon, even with no fans.

I do have hope that a buyer in the league will exist at some point. Probably a network like FOX would be the most likely one.

4th&long
Coach
Posts: 535
Joined: Sun Nov 24, 2019 2:27 pm

Re: OL, Week 6, VM and the XFL bankruptcy

Post by 4th&long » Tue Apr 28, 2020 12:44 am

Metallifreak10 wrote:
Mon Apr 27, 2020 10:58 pm
I don’t think we’ll be switching to “herd immunity” by June 1st. But, I do think we will switch to something closer to that of Sweden nonetheless.

Vince doesn’t want to cancel for anything. I recall at the time hoping for just one more week of play so the XFL could be the only show in town, just like Vince. Unfortunately, we didn’t have a lot of information about COVID at the time, and it would’ve been hard to justify the risk when every other league canceled play.

Now, we do know some information. Likely death rates being under 1%, and young people being extremely low risk. Not no risk, but low risk. So, with the new information, it’s time we move ahead and continue mitigation, but allow more businesses to open. Hopefully sports will comeback soon, even with no fans.

I do have hope that a buyer in the league will exist at some point. Probably a network like FOX would be the most likely one.
Sweden IS basically following the herd immunity approach.

people under 30 have VIRTUAL no risk sans a medical condition - look at the numbers in Mass. for example... And that's reported cases which NY's antibody testings says is likely 10 times higher (LA and Santa Clara studies even higher) tests.
Mass 31 deaths of people under 50 yrold out of 25000 cases reported (under 50yo) that's .125%; figure there are 9/10x that not reporting and the % is .0125% or 1.2/10000.

https://www.mass.gov/doc/covid-19-dashb ... 0/download

Look at NJ a total of 253 uner 50yo's dead out of a gross (all ages) 111,000 reported cases - slightly higher but similar %. That's about the same as the Flu.

https://covid19.nj.gov/#live-updates

Now for 50-59 it increases, And again for 60-69; the 60-80+ is 84% of NY state deaths. Science clearly says under 40 - are EXTREMELY safe and 40-50 very low risk, 50-59 low risk and 60 up risk grows fast.

Testing in prisons are showing 95/96% asymptomatic - 2x what NY concluded. The reports keep coming in...
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-heal ... SKCN2270RX

It's still April, wait till we get more AB test and the pressure for lockdown will evaporate. We can be prudent without alarmist. Not to mention Remdesivir - which if approved as a treatment with strong results further allows opening up.

Expect sports leagues to key on these reports and start pushing to open...

And as far as Football - the NFL Draft mega ratings 4 hours 15.6mm viewers thrusday, 8.4 mm 5 hours Friday and 4.2mm 7hours Saturday - Is all the proof you need that someone will bring spring FB back.

User avatar
johnnyangryfuzzball
Coach
Posts: 748
Joined: Sat Apr 27, 2019 8:22 pm

Re: OL, Week 6, VM and the XFL bankruptcy

Post by johnnyangryfuzzball » Tue Apr 28, 2020 9:06 am

They're finding that in hard-hit The Bronx, 3 out of every 7 people have virus antibodies. Herd immunity is estimated at around 3 out of 5, and that's WITH the lockdowns. It's almost as if these lockdowns failed to stop anything.

But golly gee, we're seeing insurance companies, scared and uncertain, pulling their coverage. That's what's going to make this a long and boring summer.

4th&long
Coach
Posts: 535
Joined: Sun Nov 24, 2019 2:27 pm

Re: OL, Week 6, VM and the XFL bankruptcy

Post by 4th&long » Tue Apr 28, 2020 10:29 am

johnnyangryfuzzball wrote:
Tue Apr 28, 2020 9:06 am
They're finding that in hard-hit The Bronx, 3 out of every 7 people have virus antibodies. Herd immunity is estimated at around 3 out of 5, and that's WITH the lockdowns. It's almost as if these lockdowns failed to stop anything.

But golly gee, we're seeing insurance companies, scared and uncertain, pulling their coverage. That's what's going to make this a long and boring summer.
What insurance are "they" pulling and who is they?

Metallifreak10
Running Back
Posts: 152
Joined: Tue Oct 29, 2019 9:44 am

Re: OL, Week 6, VM and the XFL bankruptcy

Post by Metallifreak10 » Tue Apr 28, 2020 11:05 am

4th&long wrote:
Tue Apr 28, 2020 12:44 am
Metallifreak10 wrote:
Mon Apr 27, 2020 10:58 pm
Sweden IS basically following the herd immunity approach.

people under 30 have VIRTUAL no risk sans a medical condition - look at the numbers in Mass. for example... And that's reported cases which NY's antibody testings says is likely 10 times higher (LA and Santa Clara studies even higher) tests.
Mass 31 deaths of people under 50 yrold out of 25000 cases reported (under 50yo) that's .125%; figure there are 9/10x that not reporting and the % is .0125% or 1.2/10000.

https://www.mass.gov/doc/covid-19-dashb ... 0/download

Look at NJ a total of 253 uner 50yo's dead out of a gross (all ages) 111,000 reported cases - slightly higher but similar %. That's about the same as the Flu.

https://covid19.nj.gov/#live-updates

Now for 50-59 it increases, And again for 60-69; the 60-80+ is 84% of NY state deaths. Science clearly says under 40 - are EXTREMELY safe and 40-50 very low risk, 50-59 low risk and 60 up risk grows fast.

Testing in prisons are showing 95/96% asymptomatic - 2x what NY concluded. The reports keep coming in...
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-heal ... SKCN2270RX

It's still April, wait till we get more AB test and the pressure for lockdown will evaporate. We can be prudent without alarmist. Not to mention Remdesivir - which if approved as a treatment with strong results further allows opening up.

Expect sports leagues to key on these reports and start pushing to open...

And as far as Football - the NFL Draft mega ratings 4 hours 15.6mm viewers thrusday, 8.4 mm 5 hours Friday and 4.2mm 7hours Saturday - Is all the proof you need that someone will bring spring FB back.
I guess I should clarify. I understand Sweden is trying to achieve Herd immunity, I was just stating that I don’t believe the US will quite get to that point. They’ll move in that direction, but not fully.

I don’t disagree with the numbers, and that is why I think we need to move forward with reopening. But, I don’t see things happening so quickly here. This thing is more political than anything now.

GDAWG
Coach
Posts: 882
Joined: Wed Feb 20, 2019 6:15 pm

Re: OL, Week 6, VM and the XFL bankruptcy

Post by GDAWG » Tue Apr 28, 2020 2:31 pm

4th&long wrote:
Mon Apr 27, 2020 9:32 pm
Read the full article

https://www.xflnewshub.com/columns/nfl- ... ue-legacy/

>>>> According to sources close to the situation, Vince McMahon did not want to suspend play at that point. McMahon and Luck were at odds over the issue. The delay in making the suspension announcement was Oliver Luck trying to convince McMahon that it was the league’s only recourse.

The XFL had already announced that the week six game between Seattle and LA would be played as scheduled at Century Link Field without fans in attendance. (State orders)

The New York Guardians and Houston Roughnecks were all set to play at Metlife Stadium that weekend despite New Jersey Governor Phil Murphy making a last-second recommendation to limit crowd gatherings.

In an interview with Kevin Gilbride done by Jeff Jacobs from The Middletown Press. Guardians Head Coach Kevin Gilbride broke down his conversation with Vince McMahon; the day league play was suspended
----------
Kevin Gilbride got a call at 4 p.m. on Thursday. The players were finishing their after-practice meetings. Gilbride was told, because of COVID-19, New Jersey Gov. Phil Murphy had issued a statement recommending no crowds of more than 250 should gather.
“The XFL was considering whether we were going to honor it or not,” Gilbride said. “The next thing you know, I got a call at 5 o’clock that Vince McMahon said the hell with it, it was a recommendation. It wasn’t mandatory. We knew we were going to have the biggest crowd of the year. Houston was the top team in the league. He said the hell with it. We’re letting the crowds come.”

At 6 pm., Gilbride got the third call. The XFL had canceled the remainder of their season.

“So in two hours we went from discussing no fans to we’re all done,” Gilbride said. <<<<

I alluded to this in other threads - This was the dagger that killed it for VM - he wanted that week 6 - with no other sports XFL would have dominated. It would have gotten attention it never would have gotten. Now we know the game would have been heavily attended. The league needed a big sendoff if it was going to survive - that would have been it. OL took the safe route, VM needed an Elon Musk, Jeff Bezoa, a real Business man and OL played the part of bureaucrat. (I like OL and he did a great job but don't defy the boss, VM was right.). I hoped VM was all on board but I knew that was a HUGE missed opportunity. VM was NOT on board and eventually he decided he could not work with OL and the XFL is now in bankruptcy and up for sale.

And after major hype we are learning that China Virus may not be that deadly at all under 60 with 40 almost non-existent (certainly under 30 - based on death stats and Antibody tests in NY showing infects 11 times what was reported). NJ had 1100 deaths under 65 thru 4/26. Would this game really matter? Wait for it... we'll be switching to herd immunity by June 1st in all states. [NOTE: Seniors and those with med issues under 60 diff story]

So VM may have realize he over reacted, and he isn't happy with that. No one is. But he is PO'd at OL and that's that.
A Dragons player tested positive, so if the league wasn't to shut down after week 5, it would have shut down as soon as that player tested positive.

4th&long
Coach
Posts: 535
Joined: Sun Nov 24, 2019 2:27 pm

Re: OL, Week 6, VM and the XFL bankruptcy

Post by 4th&long » Tue Apr 28, 2020 6:22 pm

Metallifreak10 wrote:
Tue Apr 28, 2020 11:05 am
4th&long wrote:
Tue Apr 28, 2020 12:44 am
Metallifreak10 wrote:
Mon Apr 27, 2020 10:58 pm
Sweden IS basically following the herd immunity approach.

people under 30 have VIRTUAL no risk sans a medical condition - look at the numbers in Mass. for example... And that's reported cases which NY's antibody testings says is likely 10 times higher (LA and Santa Clara studies even higher) tests.
Mass 31 deaths of people under 50 yrold out of 25000 cases reported (under 50yo) that's .125%; figure there are 9/10x that not reporting and the % is .0125% or 1.2/10000.

https://www.mass.gov/doc/covid-19-dashb ... 0/download

Look at NJ a total of 253 uner 50yo's dead out of a gross (all ages) 111,000 reported cases - slightly higher but similar %. That's about the same as the Flu.

https://covid19.nj.gov/#live-updates

Now for 50-59 it increases, And again for 60-69; the 60-80+ is 84% of NY state deaths. Science clearly says under 40 - are EXTREMELY safe and 40-50 very low risk, 50-59 low risk and 60 up risk grows fast.

Testing in prisons are showing 95/96% asymptomatic - 2x what NY concluded. The reports keep coming in...
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-heal ... SKCN2270RX

It's still April, wait till we get more AB test and the pressure for lockdown will evaporate. We can be prudent without alarmist. Not to mention Remdesivir - which if approved as a treatment with strong results further allows opening up.

Expect sports leagues to key on these reports and start pushing to open...

And as far as Football - the NFL Draft mega ratings 4 hours 15.6mm viewers thrusday, 8.4 mm 5 hours Friday and 4.2mm 7hours Saturday - Is all the proof you need that someone will bring spring FB back.
I guess I should clarify. I understand Sweden is trying to achieve Herd immunity, I was just stating that I don’t believe the US will quite get to that point. They’ll move in that direction, but not fully.

I don’t disagree with the numbers, and that is why I think we need to move forward with reopening. But, I don’t see things happening so quickly here. This thing is more political than anything now.
In the middle of a crisis and its all attack 24/7 Just when impeachment fails - its China Virus. Lots of money behind maintaining cheap chinese labor and trade. It really is amazing..... but that's for another forum.. :o :mrgreen:

We'll see how it goes but I expect states will open up sooner vs later and that's good for getting sports back.

4th&long
Coach
Posts: 535
Joined: Sun Nov 24, 2019 2:27 pm

Re: OL, Week 6, VM and the XFL bankruptcy

Post by 4th&long » Tue Apr 28, 2020 6:26 pm

GDAWG wrote:
Tue Apr 28, 2020 2:31 pm
4th&long wrote:
Mon Apr 27, 2020 9:32 pm
Read the full article

https://www.xflnewshub.com/columns/nfl- ... ue-legacy/

>>>> According to sources close to the situation, Vince McMahon did not want to suspend play at that point. McMahon and Luck were at odds over the issue. The delay in making the suspension announcement was Oliver Luck trying to convince McMahon that it was the league’s only recourse.

The XFL had already announced that the week six game between Seattle and LA would be played as scheduled at Century Link Field without fans in attendance. (State orders)

The New York Guardians and Houston Roughnecks were all set to play at Metlife Stadium that weekend despite New Jersey Governor Phil Murphy making a last-second recommendation to limit crowd gatherings.

In an interview with Kevin Gilbride done by Jeff Jacobs from The Middletown Press. Guardians Head Coach Kevin Gilbride broke down his conversation with Vince McMahon; the day league play was suspended
----------
Kevin Gilbride got a call at 4 p.m. on Thursday. The players were finishing their after-practice meetings. Gilbride was told, because of COVID-19, New Jersey Gov. Phil Murphy had issued a statement recommending no crowds of more than 250 should gather.
“The XFL was considering whether we were going to honor it or not,” Gilbride said. “The next thing you know, I got a call at 5 o’clock that Vince McMahon said the hell with it, it was a recommendation. It wasn’t mandatory. We knew we were going to have the biggest crowd of the year. Houston was the top team in the league. He said the hell with it. We’re letting the crowds come.”

At 6 pm., Gilbride got the third call. The XFL had canceled the remainder of their season.

“So in two hours we went from discussing no fans to we’re all done,” Gilbride said. <<<<

I alluded to this in other threads - This was the dagger that killed it for VM - he wanted that week 6 - with no other sports XFL would have dominated. It would have gotten attention it never would have gotten. Now we know the game would have been heavily attended. The league needed a big sendoff if it was going to survive - that would have been it. OL took the safe route, VM needed an Elon Musk, Jeff Bezoa, a real Business man and OL played the part of bureaucrat. (I like OL and he did a great job but don't defy the boss, VM was right.). I hoped VM was all on board but I knew that was a HUGE missed opportunity. VM was NOT on board and eventually he decided he could not work with OL and the XFL is now in bankruptcy and up for sale.

And after major hype we are learning that China Virus may not be that deadly at all under 60 with 40 almost non-existent (certainly under 30 - based on death stats and Antibody tests in NY showing infects 11 times what was reported). NJ had 1100 deaths under 65 thru 4/26. Would this game really matter? Wait for it... we'll be switching to herd immunity by June 1st in all states. [NOTE: Seniors and those with med issues under 60 diff story]

So VM may have realize he over reacted, and he isn't happy with that. No one is. But he is PO'd at OL and that's that.
A Dragons player tested positive, so if the league wasn't to shut down after week 5, it would have shut down as soon as that player tested positive.
I understand and that may have been the deciding factor but Week 6 was a huge missed opp. I understand states had lockdown laws in place fully by week 7 so that was that, but this is about week 6 and how it could have been a grand slam for the XFL on TV; and how OL lost VM's confidence.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/x ... 050221002/

>> The league said in a statement that the player, who is a member of the Seattle Dragons, reported his symptoms to team medical staff on Tuesday and was immediately placed in quarantine, where he has remained in the days since.<<

Even if the Seattle 3/15 game was played w/o fans they could have played thru. BTW did any other Dragon players get sick?

User avatar
johnnyangryfuzzball
Coach
Posts: 748
Joined: Sat Apr 27, 2019 8:22 pm

Re: OL, Week 6, VM and the XFL bankruptcy

Post by johnnyangryfuzzball » Tue Apr 28, 2020 7:07 pm

4th&long wrote:
Tue Apr 28, 2020 6:26 pm
GDAWG wrote:
Tue Apr 28, 2020 2:31 pm
4th&long wrote:
Mon Apr 27, 2020 9:32 pm
Read the full article

https://www.xflnewshub.com/columns/nfl- ... ue-legacy/

>>>> According to sources close to the situation, Vince McMahon did not want to suspend play at that point. McMahon and Luck were at odds over the issue. The delay in making the suspension announcement was Oliver Luck trying to convince McMahon that it was the league’s only recourse.

The XFL had already announced that the week six game between Seattle and LA would be played as scheduled at Century Link Field without fans in attendance. (State orders)

The New York Guardians and Houston Roughnecks were all set to play at Metlife Stadium that weekend despite New Jersey Governor Phil Murphy making a last-second recommendation to limit crowd gatherings.

In an interview with Kevin Gilbride done by Jeff Jacobs from The Middletown Press. Guardians Head Coach Kevin Gilbride broke down his conversation with Vince McMahon; the day league play was suspended
----------
Kevin Gilbride got a call at 4 p.m. on Thursday. The players were finishing their after-practice meetings. Gilbride was told, because of COVID-19, New Jersey Gov. Phil Murphy had issued a statement recommending no crowds of more than 250 should gather.
“The XFL was considering whether we were going to honor it or not,” Gilbride said. “The next thing you know, I got a call at 5 o’clock that Vince McMahon said the hell with it, it was a recommendation. It wasn’t mandatory. We knew we were going to have the biggest crowd of the year. Houston was the top team in the league. He said the hell with it. We’re letting the crowds come.”

At 6 pm., Gilbride got the third call. The XFL had canceled the remainder of their season.

“So in two hours we went from discussing no fans to we’re all done,” Gilbride said. <<<<

I alluded to this in other threads - This was the dagger that killed it for VM - he wanted that week 6 - with no other sports XFL would have dominated. It would have gotten attention it never would have gotten. Now we know the game would have been heavily attended. The league needed a big sendoff if it was going to survive - that would have been it. OL took the safe route, VM needed an Elon Musk, Jeff Bezoa, a real Business man and OL played the part of bureaucrat. (I like OL and he did a great job but don't defy the boss, VM was right.). I hoped VM was all on board but I knew that was a HUGE missed opportunity. VM was NOT on board and eventually he decided he could not work with OL and the XFL is now in bankruptcy and up for sale.

And after major hype we are learning that China Virus may not be that deadly at all under 60 with 40 almost non-existent (certainly under 30 - based on death stats and Antibody tests in NY showing infects 11 times what was reported). NJ had 1100 deaths under 65 thru 4/26. Would this game really matter? Wait for it... we'll be switching to herd immunity by June 1st in all states. [NOTE: Seniors and those with med issues under 60 diff story]

So VM may have realize he over reacted, and he isn't happy with that. No one is. But he is PO'd at OL and that's that.
A Dragons player tested positive, so if the league wasn't to shut down after week 5, it would have shut down as soon as that player tested positive.
I understand and that may have been the deciding factor but Week 6 was a huge missed opp. I understand states had lockdown laws in place fully by week 7 so that was that, but this is about week 6 and how it could have been a grand slam for the XFL on TV; and how OL lost VM's confidence.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/x ... 050221002/

>> The league said in a statement that the player, who is a member of the Seattle Dragons, reported his symptoms to team medical staff on Tuesday and was immediately placed in quarantine, where he has remained in the days since.<<

Even if the Seattle 3/15 game was played w/o fans they could have played thru. BTW did any other Dragon players get sick?
I don't think there have been ANY sicknesses reported from person-to-person contact at an XFL game, as far as I can tell. Even the concession worker at the Dragons game didn't get anyone ill. But then again, contact tracing in the early stages of this virus was notoriously slow and difficult, so we don't know.

We do know, based on an increasing number of studies and observations, that outdoor transmission is not as virulent as indoor transmission.

Post Reply